Tata Safari Storme Breaks Cover (Launch Coverage: Pg.301+)

[THE XOVER]

Re: Scoop! New Tata Safari (aka Merlin) To Launch Soon

@ tornado 78

Hello tornado welcome to TAI, yes I absolutely agree with you on all the above points,but still I am hoping against hope that not only tata displays new safari on auto expo but also launches it in 5 metros to begin with on 7th january itself.And pan INDIA launch can take place in April.Fingers crossed.

 

[shailinder]

Re: Scoop! New Tata Safari (aka Merlin) To Launch Soon

Welcome aboard Tornado, please spare some time and introduce yourself at Introductions thread.

Good to note that you are also the fan of Safari like many.

Have a pleasant stay at TAI and be in touch with us for any support.

 

[Surfer]

Re: Scoop! New Tata Safari (aka Merlin) To Launch Soon

Good scoop mukesh, hope we can see merlin in Jan auto expo. If they price it well then it will outsell for sure.

 

[Vishwas]

Re: Scoop! New Tata Safari (aka Merlin) To Launch Soon

Welcome to TAI buddy .

It is better Tata is taking time to give niggle free vehicle this time, unlike M & M where XUV 500 oil, ECU & what not is being changed .

Merlin will kill not only XUV but even higher variants of Scorpio.


And it looks far more subtle & better than scorpio or in the face look of XUV. XUV I feel is a girl who has over-done the make-up !! Safari is natural beauty :).

How come you know everything about Merlin advantages And XUV disadvantages,have you driven both to compare it?

I know scorpio owners who still like Safari but bought scorpio mainly due to 2 reasons - Price & more importantly the engine.

That is the main thing that a buyer needs!.What did Tata do? Nothing

If Merlin can give linear power unlike sudden thrust of scorpio/XUV, it will be appreciated by lot.

Will feel happy if Merlin Does that.

 

[S Class]

Re: Scoop! New Tata Safari (aka Merlin) To Launch Soon

How come you know everything about Merlin advantages And XUV disadvantages,have you driven both to compare it?

I don't know everything about Merlin, just giving my reasons for it being tested a lot. And as far as XUV disadvantages are concerned, my 2 friends, both auto maniacs have driven it, while I have sat in it.
Btw, there was water problem with Swift, now does that mean I pour water in swift & check it myself ??

That is the main thing that a buyer needs!.What did Tata do? Nothing

Look at Aria, the engine feels far more refined than Safari. And what did Tata do ?? Well, they are coming up with Merlin.
Btw, do forget Safari too have got multiple engines from the days of its inception, some DCI (forgot exact name) engine earlier, then 3.0L turbo & then came 2.2 dicor.

Will feel happy if Merlin Does that.

Aria has did it, so Merlin should be able to do that.

 

[raj_5004]

Re: Scoop! New Tata Safari (aka Merlin) To Launch Soon

I don't know everything about Merlin, just giving my reasons for it being tested a lot.

Nopes. You are the one who said -

Merlin will kill not only XUV but even higher variants of Scorpio.

And as far as XUV disadvantages are concerned, my 2 friends, both auto maniacs have driven it, while I have sat in it.

Just by sitting in the XUV (not even driving it), you could so easily judge that the Merlin would be far better than the XUV. So I am assuming that you have not driven the Merlin. Then -

1) How come you could comment about it in the first place (since according to you, one should not comment about a vehicle without experiencing it!)??

2) Since you have neither driven the XUV nor the Merlin, how did you compare them & come to a conslusion than it will kill the XUV & Scorpio?

Requesting you to enlighten us, if you can.

Btw, do forget Safari too have got multiple engines from the days of its inception, some DCI (forgot exact name) engine earlier, then 3.0L turbo & then came 2.2 dicor.

Can I remind you? It was called TCIC.

TCIC - 2.0ltr - 90 bhp
Dicor - 3.0 ltr - 116 hbp
Dicor - 2.2 ltr - 140 bhp

3.0 Dicor was the antiquated engine from the TATA 407 with a common rail attached to it. Reliable - Yes. Modern - No. Fit for an SUV - No.

Aria has did it, so Merlin should be able to do that.

So all this is just an assumption? So is this not bias or is it okay in case of TATA?

It is better Tata is taking time to give niggle free vehicle this time, unlike M & M where XUV 500 oil, ECU & what not is being changed .

You call this niggles? Changing oil to improve gear shift quality is a niggle?

ECU of XUV is untouched. I think you meant that the infotainment software has been updated. That is a niggle?

 

[S Class]

Re: Scoop! New Tata Safari (aka Merlin) To Launch Soon

Just by sitting in the XUV (not even driving it), you could so easily judge that the Merlin would be far better than the XUV. So I am assuming that you have not driven the Merlin.

Simple. The seats of XUV are hopeless, especially the back rests. You simply can't feel comfortable when it comes to its back rest. And I am betting on X2 platform too.

Then -

1) How come you could comment about it in the first place (since according to you, one should not comment about a vehicle without experiencing it!)??

2) Since you have neither driven the XUV nor the Merlin, how did you compare them & come to a conslusion than it will kill the XUV & Scorpio?

I am betting on the fact that Merlin is based on Aria platform, though short one. And Aria is no doubt is good at drive & even more so for comfort, not to forget its better luggage space too.

Can I remind you? It was called TCIC.

Thanks.

So all this is just an assumption? So is this not bias or is it okay in case of TATA?

Nothing to do with Tata. It has to do with Aria. I liked Aria & since Merlin is based on Aria platform, I am betting on it.

You call this niggles? Changing oil to improve gear shift quality is a niggle?

ECU of XUV is untouched. I think you meant that the infotainment software has been updated. That is a niggle?

Add to it:-

Problems with cruise control,
Non functional TPMS.

 

[raj_5004]

Re: Scoop! New Tata Safari (aka Merlin) To Launch Soon

Simple. The seats of XUV are hopeless, especially the back rests. You simply can't feel comfortable when it comes to its back rest. And I am betting on X2 platform too.

No comment, your opinions.

I am betting on the fact that Merlin is based on Aria platform, though short one. And Aria is no doubt is good at drive & even more so for comfort, not to forget its better luggage space too.

So even after looking at the pics, when I said that I felt the old one to look better, that was not acceptable to you. And you are judging the comfort, ride, performance, etc. just based on the X2 platform & that is acceptable?



Anyways, I rest my case here.

 

[S Class]

Re: Scoop! New Tata Safari (aka Merlin) To Launch Soon

So even after looking at the pics, when I said that I felt the old one to look better, that was not acceptable to you. And you are judging the comfort, ride, performance, etc. just based on the X2 platform & that is acceptable?

I said betting on the fact......

 

[mukeshus]

Re: Scoop! New Tata Safari (aka Merlin) To Launch Soon

@Sclass: There might be owners who complain of Cruise not working, because they are not aware of the pre-conditions it requires before engaging.
It can be engaged only when RPM is above 2000 & vehicle must be above 40 -50 kmph speed.

Before they could follow this they want to complain, its not working.

And another reason for people can say Cruise not working is, they must be in top gear for non interruptive cruise, and if they have engaged cruise in 5th gear and would like to upshift further, then the cruise deactivates with a touch of clutch or brake pedal.
All these instances make cruise to deactivate not fail.

And before they learn certain things, they add up as a issue.

In my Scorpio the cruise is working from day 1 & no issues with it till now.

Btw i have a friend working in TATA Advanced Materials Pune.

He said Safari's rims are based on Aria Platform, i don't think Safari can handle well, until its height is reduced, as we can see boxy rear safari, which is a 1st threat to Safari in Handling section, as well as it must have Roll over mitigation to compensate for the tall design, in order to overcome the body roll.
As well as i can still see the same old boring steering wheel.
Which could have included the cruise and remaining features, if not there in current mule.

 

[THE XOVER]

Re: Scoop! New Tata Safari (aka Merlin) To Launch Soon

It is better Tata is taking time to give niggle free vehicle this time, unlike M & M where XUV 500 oil, ECU & what not is being changed .

Yes buddy really heartening to see Tata testing Merlin so extensively, hope they come out with a completely ready product rather than an underbaked SUV where they need to change everything from steering to oil from the day one of its launch.Also this time people are expecting Land Rover to play major role in tuning of Merlin , lets see how it comes up,fingers crossed.

Merlin will kill not only XUV but even higher variants of Scorpio.
I know scorpio owners who still like Safari but bought scorpio mainly due to 2 reasons - Price & more importantly the engine. If Merlin can give linear power unlike sudden thrust of scorpio/XUV, it will be appreciated by lot.

As far as Merlin killing XUV, I don't know but Scorpio better watch out if as you said Tata gets price and engine tuning right.And yes seeing the refinement of Aria 4x2 motor and its acceleration, the smaller Merlin may be even faster.

And it looks far more subtle & better than scorpio or in the face look of XUV. XUV I feel is a girl who has over-done the make-up !! Safari is natural beauty :).

New Merlin would not look classy but quirky from the front, but from the sides will look like the current Safari.I think people may not like it first up, though in due course of time they may even start to love it.Really all eyes are now upon second week of January, all our questions will be answered then,lets hope for the best

 

[TSIVipul]

Re: Scoop! New Tata Safari (aka Merlin) To Launch Soon

I don't know everything about Merlin, just giving my reasons for it being tested a lot. And as far as XUV disadvantages are concerned, my 2 friends, both auto maniacs have driven it, while I have sat in it.
Btw, there was water problem with Swift, now does that mean I pour water in swift & check it myself ??

I can't agree here,I really can't.Why?
Because I believe that every person has a different taste.A person likes the responsive steering of Fiesta while another can like the feather light one of Verna,so no comments.It depends on the taste of the buyer,what he/she may like.

Look at Aria, the engine feels far more refined than Safari. And what did Tata do ?? Well, they are coming up with Merlin.
Btw, do forget Safari too have got multiple engines from the days of its inception, some DCI (forgot exact name) engine earlier, then 3.0L turbo & then came 2.2 dicor.

The engine is same,only some small changes have been made,basically its the better NVH levels of Aria which make it feel more refined.Rest the overall response of Aria,especially in higher revs is absolutely better than the XUV thing,no doubt.(Again,my personal TD experience)

Aria has did it, so Merlin should be able to do that.

Akbar ruled India but his son didn't!!Do I need to say anything else.

Just by sitting in the XUV (not even driving it), you could so easily judge that the Merlin would be far better than the XUV. So I am assuming that you have not driven the Merlin. Then -

1) How come you could comment about it in the first place (since according to you, one should not comment about a vehicle without experiencing it!)??

2) Since you have neither driven the XUV nor the Merlin, how did you compare them & come to a conslusion than it will kill the XUV & Scorpio?

Requesting you to enlighten us, if you can.

Agree..

[/QUOTE]
You call this niggles? Changing oil to improve gear shift quality is a niggle?

ECU of XUV is untouched. I think you meant that the infotainment software has been updated. That is a niggle?

Even my Innova got a gearbox oil change within 10k kms of buying because it was having very hard shifts,from that time everything is going well,so changing gear oil is not an issue.
About infotainment software,the newer and updated software upgrade is an UPGRADE not a niggle.

Simple. The seats of XUV are hopeless, especially the back rests. You simply can't feel comfortable when it comes to its back rest. And I am betting on X2 platform too.

Great,when I TDed the XUV,I felt its seating especially the driving position even better than the Aria.Dear S Class you bet a bit too much.I hope you are not expecting the 'S' class comfort in an XUV.

Nothing to do with Tata. It has to do with Aria. I liked Aria & since Merlin is based on Aria platform, I am betting on it.

No doubt,Aria platform is definitely far better than that of XUV,it feels while driving at elevated speeds.Where XUV seems to go rebellion the Aria is calm and planted.The high speed stability of the Aria is also far far better than the XUV also the high speed ride favors the Aria,but low speed rode of XUV is better and in-city manners too favor XUV.

Problems with cruise control.

Touch the brake and cruise control goes off.In Mahindra vehicles cruise control is not for daily use,its meant for highways only.You get so much for 12 lacs okay dear.Instead in M&Ms the CC is a fancy touch none else.So you can leave it also the CC is not very much useful in India.So you can rule it out of the niggles list.
Dear,my words may sound harsh but your case has not got the enough weight for being considered.You need to do your study a bit more.DEFENDING PARTY WINS..

@
And another reason for people can say Cruise not working is, they must be in top gear for non interruptive cruise, and if they have engaged cruise in 5th gear and would like to upshift further, then the cruise deactivates with a touch of clutch or brake pedal.
All these instances make cruise to deactivate not fail.

And before they learn certain things, they add up as a issue.

In my Scorpio the cruise is working from day 1 & no issues with it till now.

+1,NO DOUBTS.As already mentioned above.

Btw i have a friend working in TATA Advanced Materials Pune.

He said Safari's rims are based on Aria Platform, i don't think Safari can handle well, until its height is reduced, as we can see boxy rear safari, which is a 1st threat to Safari in Handling section, as well as it must have Roll over mitigation to compensate for the tall design, in order to overcome the body roll.
As well as i can still see the same old boring steering wheel.
Which could have included the cruise and remaining features, if not there in current mule.

BAKWAAS(CRAP is it) and I'd say 'cut the crap' on this fact.Safari's rims based on Aria's platform will affect the handling while the Rims and tyres are of same size!!.Mukesh dear I am sure your friend needs to study it a bit more.
About the roll over etc,you need to drive Safari once.I have owned a Scorpio and a Safari both one by one and let me tell you that Safari has scary body roll but it does not overturn that easily,while its our dear Scorpio which seems to have lesser body role but turns turtle quite before the Safari does.Here in Meerut I have seen a lot of Scorpion turtles while for Safari it looks like it will turn but it does only when you twist a bit too much.The old boring steering of Safari and dash of Safari still looks better to me as compared to Scorpio(my personal opinion)and is more practical too.

Yes buddy really heartening to see Tata testing Merlin so extensively, hope they come out with a completely ready product rather than an underbaked SUV where they need to change everything from steering to oil from the day one of its launch.Also this time people are expecting Land Rover to play major role in tuning of Merlin , lets see how it comes up,fingers crossed.


As far as Merlin killing XUV, I don't know but Scorpio better watch out if as you said Tata gets price and engine tuning right.And yes seeing the refinement of Aria 4x2 motor and its acceleration, the smaller Merlin may be even faster.

New Merlin would not look classy but quirky from the front, but from the sides will look like the current Safari.I think people may not like it first up, though in due course of time they may even start to love it.Really all eyes are now upon second week of January, all our questions will be answered then,lets hope for the best.

Even Tata's too know what the XUV is doing to the market now a days and they are also intelligent enough decide the optimum pricing for their cars.Let the Merlin be launched,rest talks will be conducted afterwards.

 

[raj_5004]

Re: Scoop! New Tata Safari (aka Merlin) To Launch Soon

@Sclass: There might be owners who complain of Cruise not working, because they are not aware of the pre-conditions it requires before engaging.
It can be engaged only when RPM is above 2000 & vehicle must be above 40 -50 kmph speed.

Before they could follow this they want to complain, its not working.

Thats a very good point.

Yes buddy really heartening to see Tata testing Merlin so extensively, hope they come out with a completely ready product rather than an underbaked SUV where they need to change everything from steering to oil from the day one of its launch.

Underbaked?

Atleast some company is bothered to listen to customer feedbacks & take prompt actions, inspite of being heavily burdened by the surge of bookings...

It is not following the path of its counterpart who leave customers who invested 18 lakhs stranded on the road, cars waiting in A.S.S. for days for parts to arrive, sometimes for engineers to arrive from plant!

How many manufacturers actually pays heed to customer feedback? Mahindra could have avoided the gear oil change. That would have been beneficial for them. Why bother when the customer has already bought the car, he will anyway live with the hard gear shift. but some companies do want to change, they do want to become customer eccentric... but some people would always want to crib because they favour another rival brand & cant digest the fact that their own sweet brand is not doing this... and nothing can be done about it!

Also this time people are expecting Land Rover to play major role in tuning of Merlin , lets see how it comes up,fingers crossed.

The LR effect can be seen in the Aria's dash too, nice.

As far as Merlin killing XUV, I don't know but Scorpio better watch out if as you said Tata gets price and engine tuning right.And yes seeing the refinement of Aria 4x2 motor and its acceleration, the smaller Merlin may be even faster.

Since TATA is using the same 2.2 Dicor, it seem unlikely. Anyone who has driven both the mHawk & Dicor would easily say, the mHawk is the better engine.

Even my Innova got a gearbox oil change within 10k kms of buying because it was having very hard shifts,from that time everything is going well,so changing gear oil is not an issue.
About infotainment software,the newer and updated software upgrade is an UPGRADE not a niggle.

When they dont have anything else to nitpick, this is what they come up with!

Great,when I TDed the XUV,I felt its seating especially the driving position even better than the Aria.Dear S Class you bet a bit too much.I hope you are not expecting the 'S' class comfort in an XUV.

True.

Even I found the seats of the XUV to be very very good, infact great. I would pick the Aria for long drives maybe because of it's ride but the seats of XUV are great.

Dear,my words may sound harsh but your case has not got the enough weight for being considered.You need to do your study a bit more.DEFENDING PARTY WINS..

Even Tata's too know what the XUV is doing to the market now a days and they are also intelligent enough decide the optimum pricing for their cars.Let the Merlin be launched,rest talks will be conducted afterwards.

As far as I can guess, the Merlin will be priced as much as the XUV, that is lesser than Aria but more than Scorpio.

That is the reason, even I am waiting for the Merlin to launch.

 

[tornado78]

Re: Scoop! New Tata Safari (aka Merlin) To Launch Soon

Hi All,

Well iam a great fan of Safari (especially its looks), no other SUV in the south side of Rs 20L has the as killer looks as Safari has (this is subjective).

Now Back to Safari Merlin, no one has driven it yet, infact all of us have seen it in pics or completely camoflauged form, so there is no point in discussing about its looks. IMHO it might get a bit of Land Rover look (all based on pics) and will be based on new X2 platform with refined 2.2 VTT engine incorporating dual mass fly wheel.

AUTOCAR has given a scoop of New Safari Melin Dislay/Launch in Autoexpo 2012 and tentative price to be around 11L. Now, i guess there first information regarding Launch/preview is correct (as also confirmned by SA in TATA Motors), but pricing of 11L looks ABSURD because they have a product name ARIA @ 11.6L, so they just cannot launch Safari @ 11L. This scoop is just to get the feeler from people regarding pricing (most companies do this).

We all have to wait till the new Safari gets launched available for TD, till than we cannot comment how it drives, handles, feature lists, seating configurartions/capacity, milage, service plan, etc.

Now About XUV 500:
I have done a TD and found it to be a nice vehicle, it has a good engine capacity, drivaility of engine, gear ratios, minimal turbo lag, nice seating position, manuverability of vehicle, but what irks is its plastics and its colour combination, its exterior profile (quirky again) and not as imposing as Safari or even as Scorpio. Overall a good vehicle for those who can afford it and strictly 5 seater (adults only upto 5.3 inches and weigh less than 60kgs can sit in the last row.).

Whereas last week i have TD on ARIA as it was WOW, the space, seats, driving position, engine performance, its road presence, third ro seat (a bit better than XUV), features practicality.

If any day i have to choose a vehicle for myself in the range of 12L iwould always opt for ARIA, as it has more space, seats are more comfortable, can seat 7 if required (only small frame), can cruise 120-130 all day long and deliver you an average of 15-16kmpl,
After sale service of TATA is good, as i own a TATA Indigo LS since 2005, faced a very few niggles and trouble free ASS.

So just wait for 20 more days and things will be crystal clear.

Hope Tata will launch new Safari within 9L bracket or else it would another ARIA in terms of sales.

 

[AMG]

Re: Scoop! New Tata Safari (aka Merlin) To Launch Soon

i have been reading the thread, abut one thing fails me, what is land rover shape?

all i know is that there is hatchback shape, coupe, sedan, crossover and suv.

this LR shape is new to me.