Mahindra XUV500 vs Tata Aria vs Toyota Innova!

[raj_5004]

As far as I have read, Aria has a 0-100 timing of 14.4 seconds. If tata's 140 bhp safari cant beat the 120 bhp scorpio, how do you expect the Aria to beat XUV? It is much obvious that the lighter Mahindra would be faster. Not too forget the better torque & 6 gears advantage.

 

[THE XOVER]

Xover .35 of a second hardly matters.
Whatever after the decimal point is ignored, that doesn't matters much.
What matters to people is top speed they can do at the same time stopping capability, where as Roll over mitigation ensures that vehicle is well planted too.

Yes buddy .35 is not of that importance, but top speed of both Aria 4x2 and XUV 4x2 is quite similar in reality about 180 kmph, Source BUNNYPUNIA of Gadi.com.

Yes XUV has got roll over mitigation coupled with ESP, but top end Aria has also got ESP coupled with TCS (traction control system).

 

[350Z]

Note: Thread Cleaned. Please help us keeping the discussions healthy in an impartial community like The Automotive India. Also, strictly refrain from posting any strong statements which are either unfounded or not supported by valid claims or experiences henceforth. Your cooperation will greatly help us to maintain the decorum of this community. SUV specific discussions now moved to the relevant thread here: http://www.theautomotiveindia.com/forums/indian-auto-news/5135-big-debate-sedans-v-s-suvs.html

Drive Safe,
350Z

 

[jayadev]

it was very much a positive debate ,Raj,xover and all.. learned many new things. these kind of hot debates do attract lot of interests and inspiration for sure but do not take it personally(I know you guys dont).

Just adding my .2 cents..

I have no Idea about mahindra All i have driven much of mahindra vehicle is Bolero camper in Rajasthan desert. it was troublesome.everytime it had suspension problems and engine overheating but anywhere a local mechanic could rectify.good thing .

But i do not like mahindra products, any of them. just because they are not comfortable and seriously plagariased. from the very begining ;Jeep!!!

compared to Tata, mahindra always lagged behind.in technology as well as product.that does not mean mahindra is crap, no. or maybe they cunningly waited for tata and studied the market.

they ruled indian market due to bit of outdated and proven products. I have rarely heard about anybody saying Good FE from mahindra cars or maybe I was much ignorant.

My doubts were much strengthened about safety and build too when i saw mahindra Xylo and tata sumo bumper to bumper accident an year back on the highway near my home, where one of the guy lost his life in Xylo ,sumo got crippled but 4 Passengers were not much seriously hurt.(funnier side was, an elderly man praising how strong is mahindra car, in the middle of all those chaos)
well a buyer does not consider all these fact while buying a car, rather India is not mature enough yet imo.
that is where most of the time a good car fails in India but the old schools take the lead.
The best thing about Mahindra is they gave India what Indians wanted. A tough car,mahindra is the one that is what echoes.

isn't it strange about interior plastic quality of mahindra cars are even more pathetic than tata cars but anybody heard of it ?

I have seen as many problems and grieving mahindra owner as tata owners but comparatively,In new age cars with electronics and ecu, tata is an old player with more number of cars and issues compared to mahindra so we hear more problems from tata.



One person whom i knew owned a Bolero (2years back) which had a power steering failure and they fell into canal on the move. no serious injuries but he sold it off after 2 months as problem showed up repeatedly.
such facts do exist. Mahindra crdi cars are very much troublesome compared to any other products (this is what i heard from every corner )but strangely not much talked about .

I would prefer a Tata car against mahindra any day maybe because ,mahindra has not yet convinced me on any grounds. Let us see how Xuv score.

To me Aria is much better product in segment lest tata has a solid ASS.

I am sure xuv sales will far exceed the sales of any tata cars due to many reasons but still tata has an upper edge when it comes to over all fineness of product.

 

[raj_5004]

your comments wont be taken personally by me atleast, rest assured buddy.

First of all, I agree that Mahindras used to build crappy products before. But check their new gen products. You are saying you have driven a bolero in Rajasthan, how well maintained was it? drive the new scorpio mHawk or the XUV for that matter.

yes, i do agree that TATA products have always been more comfortable. their cars have good ride & better seat comfort compared to mahindras. I would say they make cars which are meant to be driven around in. But mahindras seemed to have changed that with the XUV, although i can still say that rear seat comfort would be better in the Aria.

but mahindras on the other hand are for self driven owners. I can vouch for this that 80% of the scorpio sales is due to its fantastic engine. If you have not driven the mHawk, dude... you need to drive it! I have not seen such a fantastic diesel engine this side of 15 lakhs! For comparisons sake, since we both have Puntos, it can eat our 90 hp for breakfast, lunch & dinner!

Not that TATA's Dicor is bad, but I have heard more number of issues in them, refinement level was not as good & as mentioned earlier, turbo lag was annoying.

Regarding safety, mahindra cars are built tough. now the accident, i dont know on what circumstances it happened, so i cant comment. but yes, scorpios are known to topple, some feel the handling is nervous & the car is unstable, so can be true. again, XUV has cleared the Euro NCAP ratings.

If mahindra builds outdated products, it cant rule the SUV/MUV market for so long, can it? thing is, mahindra has always been building SUVs/MUVs & it specializes in that segment only. they dont launch a new car every 2 years. but they take their own sweet time for R&D & testing & then launch a product, but that product is generally a hit among the masses.

Plastic quality of both cars, i feel, is bad but fit & finish is better on a mahindra. I dont know about the XUV, but scorpios & xylos do not rattle easily.

Finally, talking about technology, Mahindra has always been on the forefront buddy. but they are not as aggressive as TATA. Also, TATA being a much bigger company, mahindras lack the resources in comparison. Do you know that the Scorpio Hybrid was the first diesel hybrid? Do you know that Mahindras even have a bio diesel scorpio built in house. these cars are never released as it is not feasible in the indian market right now?

If TATA was technologically superior, why did Mahindra be the first to offer a Monocoque chassis in this segment, especially when TATA has been building cars, unlike Mahindras? All mahindra cars are built completely inhouse with only some parts like suspension tuning which is outsourced, unlike TATA whose even outsources their car designs. Both companies have a 2.2 ltr diesel engine which almost the same design & structure. Why does the mHawk feel so superior to the Dicor? If you dont believe me, drive both back to back. Else, read reviews about the mHawk. it is titled to be the "most loved diesel engine" in this segment.

 

[mastersquall]

recently i have TD both car and must say mhawk is very good engine(only thing i like in scorpio , put mhwk engine in safari body its win win situation XD) but but if i compare today dicor engine with old one . it has improved lot and it response better atleast when TD my friend safari recently . I hardly came to know if engine was ON or OFF just like scorpio i have TD

 

[THE XOVER]

it was very much a positive debate ,Raj,xover and all.. learned many new things. these kind of hot debates do attract lot of interests and inspiration for sure but do not take it personally(I know you guys dont).
No, no , why to take it personally, after all these are only "point of views".

Just adding my .2 cents.
you are cordially welcome buddy.



But i do not like mahindra products, any of them. just because they are not comfortable and seriously plagariased. from the very begining ;Jeep!!!
yes ride quality was never mahindra's forte, but with the new XUV, they have redeemed themselves.



My doubts were much strengthened about safety and build too when i saw mahindra Xylo and tata sumo bumper to bumper accident an year back on the highway near my home, where one of the guy lost his life in Xylo ,sumo got crippled but 4 Passengers were not much seriously hurt.(funnier side was, an elderly man praising how strong is mahindra car, in the middle of all those chaos)
Tata have always produced stronger cars than mahindra, period


I am sure xuv sales will far exceed the sales of any tata cars due to many reasons but still tata has an upper edge when it comes to over all fineness of product.

very true, but mark my words tata haven't given up they will make a serious fight back.

yes, i do agree that TATA products have always been more comfortable. their cars have good ride & better seat comfort compared to mahindras. I would say they make cars which are meant to be driven around in. But mahindras seemed to have changed that with the XUV, although i can still say that rear seat comfort would be better in the Aria.
true

but mahindras on the other hand are for self driven owners. I can vouch for this that 80% of the scorpio sales is due to its fantastic engine. If you have not driven the mHawk, dude... you need to drive it! I have not seen such a fantastic diesel engine this side of 15 lakhs! For comparisons sake, since we both have Puntos, it can eat our 90 hp for breakfast, lunch & dinner!
Aria reaches 0-100 in 13.5 seconds, it would munch both scorpio and xuv without a belch.

Not that TATA's Dicor is bad, but I have heard more number of issues in them, refinement level was not as good & as mentioned earlier, turbo lag was annoying.
things are changing

Regarding safety, mahindra cars are built tough. now the accident, i dont know on what circumstances it happened, so i cant comment. but yes, scorpios are known to topple, some feel the handling is nervous & the car is unstable, so can be true. again, XUV has cleared the Euro NCAP ratings.
show me the ratings



Plastic quality of both cars, i feel, is bad but fit & finish is better on a mahindra. I dont know about the XUV, but scorpios & xylos do not rattle easily.
really



If TATA was technologically superior, why did Mahindra be the first to offer a Monocoque chassis in this segment, especially when TATA has been building cars, unlike Mahindras? .

Indian roads demand a much robust chassis, that is why tata developed Aria with one.

 

[raj_5004]

@ xover: Again, very conveniently, you have picked up only those statements of mine which you find convenient to debate. Its amusing to see you writing "very true" on my positives comments about TATA, everytime.

anyways, a genuine request. Please use the quote facility properly. it becomes difficult for us to quote you & reply since you just reply in bold in our quotes.

1) No point in posting 0-100 timings in every thread. the Aria timings you have posted is from one source & the XUV's timings is from completely a different source. Wait for the timings to arrive from a single & reliable source like ACI who uses VBOX to measure the timings. it not rocket science to assume that the XUV will be faster since it is lighter, has better gearing & more torque.

2) I dont see things changing. The DICOR, even in the Aria, has the famous turbo lag. You may feel its not there (even without driving it for that matter!), but if I compare it to the peppy scorpio or even innova for that matter, it is definitely present.

3) Yes, I do feel scorpios dont rattle as like you, I dont read a single review to form an opinion. This opinion has been formed after various years of ownership.

4) Why you have this misconception that a robust chassis HAS to be a ladder on frame? Please move on from this old school thinking. Modern mono chassis are so rigid that they can outperform LOF easily. All indian cars come with Mono chassis, so you mean they all will deteriorate in a few years? Yes, i do agree that LOF chassis is good in handling abuses like in off roading trails. but how many Aria or XUV owners will take it for proper hardcore offroading? Neither the Aria nor the XUV is capable for proper off roading. A Veyron's chassis handles more pressure on a track than a jeep in an off road trail, so does that mean the Veyron should have LOF chassis?

Regarding this statement of yours -

"very true, but mark my words tata haven't given up they will make a serious fight back."

They have always been fighting back but always been failing.
they fought back with the victa to take on the bolero, failed.
they fought back with the grande to take on the xylo, failed.
they fought back with safari to take on the scorpio, failed.
now lets see what they do with the Aria & Merlin.

But I pray such things should happen, competition is good!

TATA has not been a market leader in a single segment, mahindra is a market leader in 3 segments - the bolero segment, scorpio segment & XUV segment!

I like their philosophy - build in what you have your expertise, make less products but better products.

 

[cooldhaya]

Just now read some of the previous pages in this thread.


Aria doesn't rattle , atleast for me till now! Its been 18k KMS on the ODO and still no signs of rattling , our earlier Safari used to rattle and squeak over every bad road we traverse.


Haven't driven the XUV but still Aria is a comfortable cruiser at 100kmph in 5th gear at 2k RPM , tyre noise , road noise , engine noise and wind noise is very very negligible till 120kmph which is a huge improvement over the Safari we had. You will never feel the speed till you reach 130kmph. When i cruised at 100kmph first time my friends told me "what happened to you why are you driving so slowly?"


And also too early to comment on XUV'S FE again but TATA has always managed to give high FE cars. Safari gives more FE than Scorpio. Don't know about Bolero and Sumo and Xylo and Grande. I believe Aria is more FE than XUV. I got 16.5kmpl in the MID once! And i have checked the MID reading with manual calculation once and they are very accurate! And also i din't drive for a mileage marathon , i was just driving normally with speeds around 90-110kmph.

 

[raj_5004]

Aria doesn't rattle , atleast for me till now! Its been 18k KMS on the ODO and still no signs of rattling , our earlier Safari used to rattle and squeak over every bad road we traverse.

hey, I have never said Aria rattles!

Aria is a comfortable cruiser at 100kmph in 5th gear at 2k RPM , tyre noise , road noise , engine noise and wind noise is very very negligible till 120kmph which is a huge improvement over the Safari we had. You will never feel the speed till you reach 130kmph. When i cruised at 100kmph first time my friends told me "what happened to you why are you driving so slowly?"

yes, this is something which even I had noticed. the car was being chauffer driven & I was in the middle row, NVH was really really good, much better than the Innova. Dont know about the XUV.

And also too early to comment on XUV'S FE again but TATA has always managed to give high FE cars. Safari gives more FE than Scorpio. Don't know about Bolero and Sumo and Xylo and Grande. I believe Aria is more FE than XUV. I got 16.5kmpl in the MID once! And i have checked the MID reading with manual calculation once and they are very accurate! And also i din't drive for a mileage marathon , i was just driving normally with speeds around 90-110kmph.

TATAs generally always give better FE. I have heard safari gives 10-11 in mumbai city whereas my scorpio to give only 9-10 kmpl.

 

[cooldhaya]

@ Raj Buddy i never accused you for saying Aria rattles just posted some of the positives of Aria which i have noticed so far in my driving and ownership.


PS: I have still not voted in this thread. I will vote once i check out the XUV5OO.

 

[THE XOVER]

@raj_5004

Why do you think that all the info I post here is not reliable, actually I have solid proof of all the data I show here.

As far as the 0-100 timing of Aria 4x2 is concerned, it is tested by OVERDRIVE India, in your book are they not reliable, they do not have any vBox, absolute rubbish.

Any one can go to YOU TUBE and see for themselves the test drive of Aria 4x2 (white colour, Pure variant) by Sandeep Srikanth deputy head 'Overdrive India', where he says after authentic testing of Aria 4x2 that it reaches 0-100 in 13.5 seconds.Just google Aria 4x2 test, OVERDRIVE,and see it for yourself

 

[raj_5004]

@ The Xover:

I dint say that your post is unreliable. Please go through my post again & decipher the correct meaning.

All I said was, they are from 2 different sources, so one maybe using an accurate VBOX to test the timing whereas the other maybe using a simple stopwatch! so lets wait for a single source to come up with the acceleration timings of both & that single source should be reliable.

FYI, ACI mentions Aria's 0-100 timing as 13.90 seconds. XUV is 13.85 seconds, as per you. So XUV is 0.05 seconds faster, yipee! LOLZ!!

Forget this 0-100 timings buddy, such a minor difference does not matter, lets have a look at the more important 20-80 & 40-100 figures. they will show the real world performance. SUVs are not meant for drag races that we are comparing 0-100 timings!

 

[raj_5004]

XUV500 v/s Fortuner -

Mahindra XUV500 vs Toyota Fortuner comparison of performance, offroading ability, specifications and value for money | DWS Auto India

 

[S Class]

but mahindras on the other hand are for self driven owners. I can vouch for this that 80% of the scorpio sales is due to its fantastic engine.

Not that TATA's Dicor is bad, but I have heard more number of issues in them, refinement level was not as good & as mentioned earlier, turbo lag was annoying.

And one never says anything about hopless BRAKING of Scorpio. One never gets braking confidence like Safari. The HANDLING too is poor of scorpio.
Why aren't these 2 aspects never highlighted ??

XUV has cleared the Euro NCAP ratings.

How many STARS ?? Please post the link here.

If mahindra builds outdated products, it cant rule the SUV/MUV market for so long, can it?

Maruti 800 too was selling for such a loooong period of time. Does this make it a good car ?

Also, TATA being a much bigger company, mahindras lack the resources in comparison.

And so do Tatas have many enemies, be it Maruti or Hyundai.
When Nano catches fire, BIG NEWS. When WAGON-R catches fire, NO NEWS;
Nano with single wiper- cheap, Etios with single wiper-innovative way to cut cost .

Do you know that the Scorpio Hybrid was the first diesel hybrid?

Dude, this was marketing gimmick. This was micro-hybrid & not Hybrid. If you want to know what is TRUE HYBRID, check out the BLUE-EFFICIENCY tech of Merc.

If TATA was technologically superior, why did Mahindra be the first to offer a Monocoque chassis in this segment, especially when TATA has been building cars, unlike Mahindras?

by this logic, even Toyota is poor in tech coz even Fortuner doesn't have monocoque chassis !!

They have always been fighting back but always been failing.
they fought back with the victa to take on the bolero, failed.
they fought back with the grande to take on the xylo, failed.
they fought back with safari to take on the scorpio, failed.
now lets see what they do with the Aria & Merlin.

Xylo too was a failure. Here is other list:-

Mahindra Classic- Failed,
Mahindra Thar - Failed,
Mahindra Verito Vs Tata Manza - Failed,
Mahindra Genio Vs Tata 207 - Failed,
Mahindra Maximo Vs Tata Ace - Failed.

TATA has not been a market leader in a single segment, mahindra is a market leader in 3 segments - the bolero segment, scorpio segment & XUV segment!

Don't judge success by bookings. Had that been the case, Toyota Etios would have been success .
To know real worth of vehicle, let us see what happens 1 year down the line with XUV.

I would prefer a Tata car against mahindra any day maybe because ,mahindra has not yet convinced me on any grounds. Let us see how Xuv score.

To me Aria is much better product in segment lest tata has a solid ASS.

I am sure xuv sales will far exceed the sales of any tata cars due to many reasons but still tata has an upper edge when it comes to over all fineness of product.

Agree & to large extent, due to many rivals, Tata products are given bad name which may not be in reality.

XUV500 v/s Fortuner -

Mahindra XUV500 vs Toyota Fortuner comparison of performance, offroading ability, specifications and value for money | DWS Auto India

As usual PAID REVIEWS. Kept out Tata Aria from the list.