Does Sales Figures of a Car Matter in Your Buying Decision?

[Superbad]

Re: Car Sales Figures – Do They Really Matter To You?

I have made your 5th point bold .
We all know a car loses its value 25-35% moment it leaves the showroom right ?

Raj punto was 7. 80 lakhs on road he used it one year with 15,000 Kms and sold for 5.80 lakhs , if we calculate even with 25% the depreciated value comes to 2. 34 lakhs right ?
Guess what he just sold it for 2 lakhs less from his on road price for a car which only sales 200-300 units per month do you think he faced a loss ?

How much you think he would got for a i20 under similar scenario , which is the best seller ?

there were a lot of issues for a resale value to differ on case to case basis.

i am pretty sure this resale value which raj got wont be the same with others who had a punto.

some points i would like to add in that regard which might have got better resale.

1) a good word of mouth review on punto with regard s to its build quality, and handling on high speeds.

2) the age of the vehicle. some cars are known to not age better with time.

his was only a year old and not too much of kms clocked on it.

3) he adding a freebie of a kicka$$ audio system. that might have tilted the buyer in its favour.

4) i guess raj takes good car of his vehicle, and by that virtue (periodic detailing jobs) the car might have looked sparkling new to lure the prospective customer in his favour.

i seem to remember that he had a hard time getting a better buyer/price for his vehicle.

 

[Gurrala74]

Re: Car Sales Figures – Do They Really Matter To You?

If re-sale is also a concern to look at the car sales figures while buying, then read these cases.

1. A swift diesel with good sales numbers fetch a good resale(as many on offer in local classifieds every day are going with very good price)

2. A XUV diesel with good sales numbers at present, but when we tried to resale a XUV W8 of my friend and the asking price(9-10L) was not justified for a 1-1/2months old vehicle.

3. A Ritz diesel with poor sales numbers compared to other cars like Swift, Figo, but I get a very good price(5-6L) today after 2 years and 20k odo reading.

 

[Superbad]

Re: Car Sales Figures – Do They Really Matter To You?

If re-sale is also a concern to look at the car sales figures while buying, then read these cases.


2. A XUV diesel with good sales numbers at present, but when we tried to resale a XUV W8 of my friend and the asking price(9-10L) was not justified for a 1-1/2months old vehicle.

depends on the reasoning on why it is being sold.

Ex:

if the reason mentioned are on these lines

I could say better than Storm in their color and fit and finish wise and dash is filled with so many things and I think this is only the plus point for
front seats are bit comfortable and 2nd is just ok without thigh support and 3rd is really cramped.

Always bumpy except for driver seat, it transfer all the bumps of road and surprise is on a good NH also it is the same feeling, hence very bad ride quality. front seats are bit spacious and have some support to thighs but 2nd row though the legroom is ok, but the seats are on bit higher position than front row and there is no thigh support and always bumpy. completely dissatisfied.

gears are good as they are bit short, but the position is not comfortable as one has to twist their arm, the knob could have been placed little near to the dash board. brakes are really scary and no confidence at all, NVH levels are high and lot of tyre noise present

there is lot of scary feeling before the vehicle stops and if you sit in 2nd row then you just feel like falling on driver suddenly

not easy and feel like loosing control of the beast

if 3rd is not folded then, no space at all, one has to fold the 3rd row to create the boot space. The 3rd is not suitable for adults of some 5'10", it is just like sitting in a share Auto

then anybody will think that the XUV on offer is a lemonest lemon of all the XUV, so price is right.

 

[Raja]

Re: Car Sales Figures – Do They Really Matter To You?

[

=manojodungat;266260]Personally it is still very early to comment on Duster.
At the same time, lets accept the fact that it has the best in class ride quality , proven engine ,excellent FE,

agreed you are right .

excellent boot space for a five seater,

again agreed

descent and better interiors

subjective and the interiors have polarizing views some feel the quality is atrocious , I personally don't find any problem . [

as reported in reliable online reviews]compared to its competition in the price bracket and the initial pricing

what exactly is dusters competetion acoording to you ?

along with its imposing macho SUV looks should have been some of its positives which I too feel can't be ignored.

Looks are again subjective in nature hope you agree . I personally love the look a LOT, some senior members on our forum find the duster ugly and its resemblance to a hibernating frog .

Duster being a product of Renault [which enjoys a good brand image and reputation world wide]must have given people the confidence needed to go in for its brand new product[in india].

Btw its the same Renault , who came with Logan , dumped mahindra and ran away in the middle hope you remember it since it was not too long in the past . It was only becuase of mahindra the owners survived for the a.s.s support.

Suzuki had to stop its operation in USA because no sales atall , here they enjoy 45% market share . Fiat and vw are top sellers in brazil in India we know what is happening specially with fiat .
Jaaz is one of Hondas best selling car worldwide in India it was the biggest flop .


Worldwide ranking .
Suzuki rank is =10 and GM = 1

In India Suzuki -maruti = 45% market share. number 1 position

Gm = 3.32% market share number 6th position .

Global reputation has nothing to do with country sepecific sales and vice a versa.

World Top Ranking Car Companies – 1Reservoir.com

Yes. At the same time the scheduled service intervals is not bad at all for Duster

.
So does that mean they can have less a.s.s.c ? You infact gave big importance to country wide service stations .

Also there weren't any duster owner from the first batch running back to its ASC with any alarming issues I guess.

Owners had to travel 300 Kms to fix rattling issues , and water leaking inside the car issue and had to keep the car in a.s.s.c for some odd 15 -20 days right after buying it . This is for your reference
Asymmetrical draining - YouTube

Renault Duster Accumulted water - YouTube


Renault Duster Water Leakage - YouTube

Rusting on sterring rods upto an extent that an cause serious issue

Check this for images

https://www.google.com/search?hl=en...399.0j1j1.2.0...0.0...1ac.1.5.img.mYZdu-UIi4A

And this


https://www.google.com/search?q=ren...TJrAe0sID4Bg&ved=0CAgQ_AUoAA&biw=1024&bih=644

And this

http://www.theautomotiveindia.com/f...-here-experience-avia-renault-east-delhi.html







[

B]But now that they have increased its price ridiculously and with more competition expected [read Ecosport], I certainly see a decline in Duster sales figures in the near future.
[/B]

If there is a decline in sales will it make duster devoid of all the good qualities you mentioned before ?

It is very unlikey buddy unless every single one of us have completely different requirements and expectations from a car. As I said earlier the sales figures should not be just the only criteria in choosing a vehicle and those cars which fares in those selection parameters will ultimately sell good

.
I agree with you about the requirements and they won't be same so I had asked a question .

The bold part is something iam advocating too, Judge the car by its ability and your requirements first , if it happens to be a best seller great if not the ability of the car dosent vanish irrespective of its low sales . ( again iam not atall advocating to buy market duds , Iam just putting across a point that market duds doesn't mean bad cars .)

Buddy, we indians are a bit more serious when it comes to spending our hard earned money. A bit better than what your favourate word "Herd" suggests.

Iam a Indian like you and proud to be one like you .

"we indians are a bit more serious when it comes to spending our hard earned money"
This statement of yours is your personal belief ? Or its a well researched documented academic fact ? If yes kindly provide any link to the study .

One google search will give you countless examples of Indians getting duped for their hard earned money .
There are countless examples of dealers cheating buyers , selling test drive cars as new ones , asking more money on insurance , depot charges and what not .

And one more intresting thread for a read

http://www.theautomotiveindia.com/f...-certified-used-cars-myths-facts-exposed.html

And how did you assume my favorite word is " herd " just because I posted some studies done by eminent psychologist on " herd mentality " .?

Buddy,we have no right to question this here,the competence and proficiency of people of our country, unless we have any academic record to prove otherwise. Just because majority of those people are not forum members, we can't say they aren't well informed.

Iam not questioning anything buddy , can show if I did that ? Rather iam asking what percentage of people are auto enthusiast and informed if you know tell me if not avoid My question .

If it had some kind academic record I would never asked the question in first place here , I would posted the link itself .

If a product sells good consistently, it will never be a bad car if not a great car.
If I am planning to buy a car in a segment with the best seller at 5000 units/month, there is no reason why i should not consider that to be a better car compared to the one which finds only 5-50 takers every month.

I have never argued that anyone must not consider .

That will help me do more research on the latter to find the real but hidden causes of its consistent low sale, if any, before making that very important final decision.

Agreed with you again , research is important .

amippjpr;266263]+1
At times I see lot of people participating in internet discussions just think that only they are intelligent and show disrespect to those who are not part of the online forums and buy the cars, which are not liked buy so called forum experts.

Forum is accssed by Internet atleast our forum is , and the basic idea of a forum is to discuss , debate , share , learn , and get educated in a respectfull and healthy way . I was a complete noob and iam still a noob and TAI has been the greatest source of learning when it comes to anything related to automobiles .

And now Can you kindly show were anyone has shown disrespect to people who don't vist forums ? Or is just your assumption sir ?

The moderators also never call them forum experts inspite of having immense knowledge , every member here is contributor .

And since you too are involved in this discussion what should we think of you a forum expert or a humble knowledgeable member like us who is kind enough to post his view on this thread ?

For example Maruti sales half of the cars in our country. And experts think that Maruti doesn't make good cars and people who are buying them do not have mind.

wow again you are assuming things sir , kindly show one post on this thread were any member has said so What you are claming .

In TAI there are just members and no experts atleast I belive so .

For you information if you read some post above iam infact saying sx4 is one of the most reliable , problem free product from maruti , better then verna too inspite of its low sales .

But reality is that most of the population live in small towns and villages where Maruti service and spares are easily available, thats the main reason Maruti is popular amongst most.

+100 you are right sir maruti has biggest a.s.s.c in India .
And do you mean maruti is only popular because spares are easily available ? Are all maruti products popular ?

Thats the whole point. And if someone considers sales numbers than it doesn't mean that it has to be best seller, it can be amongst the top sellers in particular category.

Agreed , and you are right .

Similarly if I want to make a choice in entry level sedan, there are options like Verna, Vento, Rapid, Linea etc are available than I would pick any car from Verna, Vento and Rapid but will reject the Linea easily since I am in right state of mind.

People who buy or bought linea are not in right state of mind you think ?if yes Can you explain why if possible ? .

And thanx a lot amippjpr you bought some really interesting points in this healthy debate .

 

[manojodungat]

Re: Car Sales Figures – Do They Really Matter To You?

2. A XUV diesel with good sales numbers at present, but when we tried to resale a XUV W8 of my friend and the asking price(9-10L) was not justified for a 1-1/2months old vehicle.

That is shocking. Was it an AWD and how many kilometers clocked? In Hyderabad?

3. A Ritz diesel with poor sales numbers compared to other cars like Swift, Figo, but I get a very good price(5-6L) today after 2 years and 20k odo reading.

Who said a car is a depreciating asset.
You are probably getting a quote of more than the OTR you paid 2 years ago.

 

[Raja]

Re: Car Sales Figures – Do They Really Matter To You?

there were a lot of issues for a resale value to differ on case to case basis.

i am pretty sure this resale value which raj got wont be the same with others who had a punto.

some points i would like to add in that regard which might have got better resale.

1) a good word of mouth review on punto with regard s to its build quality, and handling on high speeds.

2) the age of the vehicle. some cars are known to not age better with time.

his was only a year old and not too much of kms clocked on it.

3) he adding a freebie of a kicka$$ audio system. that might have tilted the buyer in its favour.

4) i guess raj takes good car of his vehicle, and by that virtue (periodic detailing jobs) the car might have looked sparkling new to lure the prospective customer in his favour.

i seem to remember that he had a hard time getting a better buyer/price for his vehicle.

So as per you high sales figures dosent mean great resale ? That was what you were precisely advocating in your post .

Punto simply sells not more then 300 cars buddy .

@ mods

Can we add a poll please since members have requested it .

 

[Superbad]

Re: Car Sales Figures – Do They Really Matter To You?

when have i ever said that?

resale value gets a boost if the product is an accepted product in its segment.

i had put up my reasons why raj's punto got a better resale and also that price should not be taken as a thumb rule , since there was more on offer than just a 90hp punto.

 

[Raja]

Re: Car Sales Figures – Do They Really Matter To You?

Resale value has many variables involved and high sales is just a small part of it . Like autosafari mentioned skoda Octavia had less sales and in resale market it fetched good value even after being discontinued .

Exactly you are right , price must never be taken as a thumb rule atall . A less selling car can get great value , and high selling car can get less value .

A high selling swift in a bad condition/ accident prone will not get a good resale value . And a punto in good condition can get a good resale value case in study - raj's punto .

 

[manojodungat]

Re: Car Sales Figures – Do They Really Matter To You?

Btw its the same Renault , who came with Logan , dumped mahindra and ran away in the middle hope you remember it since it was not too long in the past . It was only becuase of mahindra the owners survived for the a.s.s support.

I am neither speaking for Renault /owner of any Renault product nor interested to do so, especially after the recent ridiculous price hike of Duster by Renault. I was only analysing on the initial success of Duster in India.

what exactly is dusters competetion acoording to you ?

Duster has actually created its own segment, a compact SUV segment if i am not wrong and the absence of head on competition in that segment is the key for its success, IMHO.
In a country of ever increasing SUV lovers like ours , its success doesn't surprise me at all.Thanks to its sedan like ride quality, it certainly would have eaten in to even some sedan/hatch market.

In Ecosport I see a competitor in the near future. But again with a 4x4 variant, Renault might neutralise the ES effect as well.Need to wait and watch.

Global reputation has nothing to do with country sepecific sales and vice a versa.

Agreed. But to add, it is not to Suzuki but to Maruti, the credit needs to be given, I guess. For establishing such a wide network of ASCs and making sure that the after sales service given to its products are satisfactory and the parts are available easily at a cheaper price.

So does that mean they can have less a.s.s.c ? You infact gave big importance to country wide service stations .

Did I say that buddy?
Just by having ASSCs in every corner of street doesn't serve its purpose but what is more important is the quality of the service done there.I don't want to drag any other brand here as an example.Its my general view not with Renault only. I personally would like to see Renault to expand its ASSC network for them to enjoy a long term success in India.

This is for your reference

Thanks for the effort.

If there is a decline in sales will it make duster devoid of all the good qualities you mentioned before ?

This is very important how one put it.I said very clearly that it is too early to come to any conclusion on Duster success now.It is all relative. I would like to state it this way,with the arrival of a better product , there would be a decline in the sales figures of Duster.

And how did you assume my favorite word is " herd " just because I posted some studies done by eminent psychologist on " herd mentality " .?

Buddy it was on a lighter note. If it you felt unpleasant please accept my apologies.

Iam a Indian like you and proud to be one like you .

"we indians are a bit more serious when it comes to spending our hard earned money"
This statement of yours is your personal belief ? Or its a well researched documented academic fact ? If yes kindly provide any link to the study .

I have no documents but prefer to believe that we Indians are better than just those "herds".

I know very well that the same Renault -Pulse & Scala haven't fared at all.
So perceived reputation of the brand is not just the only factor that makes a product hit or flop but a combination of many as I already discussed earlier.

 

[type-r]

Re: Car Sales Figures – Do They Really Matter To You?

for me, it doesnt matter at all... all my cars in my family are in fact not the cars that set the chart on fire. Civic is always beaten by Altis and now even Prius here. In india, Xylo isnt really the best selling MUV and even the Manza is not the best seller.

 

[Raja]

Re: Car Sales Figures – Do They Really Matter To You?

I am neither speaking for Renault /owner of any Renault product nor interested to do so, especially after the recent ridiculous price hike of Duster by Renault. I was only analysing on the initial success of Duster in India.

Exactly high sales numbers dosent mean the product is perfectly superior after seeing all those QC issues .

Duster has actually created its own segment, a compact SUV segment if i am not wrong and the absence of head on competition in that segment is the key for its success, IMHO.

Exactly when there is no competition sales figure will be better because there is nothing to benchmark it against .

In a country of ever increasing SUV lovers like ours , its success doesn't surprise me at all.Thanks to its sedan like ride quality, it certainly would have eaten in to even some sedan/hatch market.

So you agree there are several more factors related to high sales ?

In Ecosport I see a competitor in the near future. But again with a 4x4 variant, Renault might neutralise the ES effect as well.Need to wait and watch.

I agree .

Agreed. But to add, it is not to Suzuki but to Maruti, the credit needs to be given, I guess. For establishing such a wide network of ASCs and making sure that the after sales service given to its products are satisfactory and the parts are available easily at a cheaper price.

Suzuki has the maximum stake in the JV , all descions are taken from Japan .and they are operating in India since 1980's and have early mover advantage then compared to others , but nevertheless what you said is right .

Thanks for the effort.

You are welcome .

Buddy it was on a lighter note. If it you felt unpleasant please accept my apologies.

apologies buddy for what ? I never felt unpleasant infact I took it in a lighter way and so i did send a wink .

I have no documents but prefer to believe that we Indians are better than just those "herds".

I too want to belive it , but facts are not supporting . Beside that herd mentality is a world wide phenomena . And belive me its a nothing bad in it . It is a part of our evolution .

 

[Gurrala74]

Re: Car Sales Figures – Do They Really Matter To You?

That is shocking. Was it an AWD and how many kilometers clocked? In Hyderabad?

No, it is not AWD, close to 6000k. Yes it is in Hyderabad



Who said a car is a depreciating asset.
You are probably getting a quote of more than the OTR you paid 2 years ago.

Yes, I paid 5.77 OTR 2 years back, yes even my car will be sold for 6 L as the new one cost close to 7 lakhs now and surprisingly single Ritz is available on local classifieds these days.

 

[navnit013]

Re: Car Sales Figures – Do They Really Matter To You?

one more story to prove 'herd mentality'.

My uncle, a couple of years back, wanted to buy a small car. He doesnt know how to drive, but his son knows. He was advised to buy ALTO k10. He on a visit to us, asked me. He was first time buyer, and he was hell bent on buying a Maruti. So I looked at his budget and advised him A-Star. As we all know here, A-Star is the new Alto. And is light years ahead of the old Alto platform. I told him the pros of having an advanced platform and other stuffs. When he departed, he was convinced and had decided he'll buy A-Star.

Fast forward three months: He comes to see us, this time in his new car. Alto K10. I was surprised. I asked him what changed his mind. Answer: Alto is a chart topper, It should be better than A-Star.

 

[manojodungat]

Re: Car Sales Figures – Do They Really Matter To You?

[=]
Exactly high sales numbers dosent mean the product is perfectly superior after seeing all those QC issues .

If those problems experienced by the real life owners are not addressed by the company,the way it should be and any of those serious problems resurface then and again on a consistent basis, it will certainly be reflected on the sales chart sooner or later.

Exactly when there is no competition sales figure will be better because there is nothing to benchmark it against .

Not necessary. If the car is not worth a buy.

So you agree there are several more factors related to high sales ?

as in "what on offer" the factors quoted by you are inclusive.

 

[Superbad]

Re: Car Sales Figures – Do They Really Matter To You?

one more story to prove 'herd mentality'.

My uncle, a couple of years back, wanted to buy a small car. He doesnt know how to drive, but his son knows. He was advised to buy ALTO k10. He on a visit to us, asked me. He was first time buyer, and he was hell bent on buying a Maruti. So I looked at his budget and advised him A-Star. As we all know here, A-Star is the new Alto. And is light years ahead of the old Alto platform. I told him the pros of having an advanced platform and other stuffs. When he departed, he was convinced and had decided he'll buy A-Star.

Fast forward three months: He comes to see us, this time in his new car. Alto K10. I was surprised. I asked him what changed his mind. Answer: Alto is a chart topper, It should be better than A-Star.

also for the fact that it was cheaper than an a-star
and in future would have given him comfort of a better resale value .

dont you think?