Battle of the Entry Level UVs: Sumo Gold vs Bolero

[dr_desai]

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[But you say pick up and refinement of Gold is better than Scorpio... Scorpio mHawk? That very very hard to digest. The mHawk is leagues ahead of the CR4.



Are you serious? You are saying the GOLD's CR4 is faster than the Scorpio's mHawk... The mHawk can easily smoke the CR4.

As far as I remember, there is atleast a 10 second gap in their acceleration timings.al]


I am not refering to pick up power of Gold in terms of 0-100 kmph. I have used the term INITIAL PICK UP .

Yes I had had to switch off AC in mHawk scorpio to negotiate some climbs in Arunachal.

Scorpio has more bhp than Gold and therfore runs faster.Gold is a people mover and not a recreational vehicle. It is not designed for very high speed.

 

[tornado78]

At present any day i'll pick up Bolero (though iam a TATA Fan), due to the followings

1. Smart Looks, and with due modification it will look much hotter
2. option of 4x4
3. No Taxi Image

I have driven Sumo once upon a time and found it to be very good. Also i have travel a lot in Sumo in year 2000 in Himachal, where i travel the entire Himachal upto Kalpa, ricang pio to Nahan to Shimla to Kullu to Pathankot area to Chamba to DHaramshal and Kangra.
We were 11 people on board in One Sumo and apart from two inclines of Jalori and Hatu Peak we always remain in the Sumo. Not even once it blinkes her eyes. Only one puncture was faced by us.

So now i can imagine the quality of SUMO GOLD.

About Bolero:

In my last company i was assigned a Bolero in year 2007-08. It was a top model. I drove it more than 8-10times and sat in the vehicle for little over 5-6 thousnads KMS.

The seating position is not comfortable at all, not even at front seats.
Stearing was over assistied and it was scary on HIgh speeds.
Low end pull was good but middle and top speed is next to non-existent in the bolero
AC was good yes only good, not great
Ride was not pliant but full of horizontal and vertical movements.
Brakes were good, just good

FE was around 13-15 kmpl

LAst row was cramped to hell

 

[THE XOVER]

I have driven Sumo Gold GX(CR4) for more than 3000 kms mostly on national highways. This car has entirely a different class and can not be compared with Sumo Victa or Spacio.It has excellent pick up power , engine smoothness, ride comfort , manoeuvrability and reliability.The sterling featre is it's 3.0 L CR4 engine which is so smooth that you seldom feel that the car has a diesel engine.

Welcome dr. desai to our wonderful forum.

Very nice review of Sumo Gold.Yes you are right many people take Sumno gold just as another Sumo variant like victa or spacio but I know that its a total different animal beneath.So nice that you have got the drift, but perhaps that's because you have driven it unlike others who have never driven it but pass it out like dady's old sumo.

I am surprised by the test drive review by Auto Car India and other reputed magazines mentioning that the top speed of this car is just 120 km/hr ! It seems that the test driver has not attempted to increase vehicle speed.I can assure that on a clear highway anyone can take it to 140km/hr very comfortably. I have once touched 152 kmph at about 2700 rpm.This would mean that if the vehicle is pushed to about 3000 rpm the speed can still go further. Since this vehicle has high centre of gravity it is risky to go above 130 km/hr.At the same time elevated driving seat position is helpful in night driving and off road driving.

I agree 120 for 85 ps max output looks really low.

Another strong point of this car is that the driver seat visibility is perhaps the best amongst all SUVS/MUVS avialable in India.The brake also seems to be very much improved.

Thanks for the feedback.Awesome info I must admit.

The negative points are
(1) taxi image
(2) very old look
(3) very short wheelbase which results into bumpy ride at very high speed
(4) absence of ABS and other safety features
(5) possibility of overturning if driven at very high speed.

Absolutely agree with all the points.If not for taxi image I think it would easily sell 5k units per month.As far as looks yes I know Bolero looks macho but subjectively speaking Sumo satisfies my aesthetic sense better than Bolero.Its simple lines do attract my heart little more.

If it is compared with Bolero and Scorpio ( no doubt both Bolero and Scorpio are good cars) the initial pick up power and engine smootness of Gold is far ahead of Bolero and scorpio.I do not like diesel engine clatter ....and that is absent in Gold CR4 even at high speeds. As the engine of Gold is massive it makes no difference whether you drive uphill with AC on or Off. This is not the case with Bolero and Scorpio.

That why this 3.0lt di engine is known as beast by those friends of us that have used/seen/felt the massive grunt of 407 engine.

 

[TSIVipul]

Okay guys,now let me put my point..

On my recent trip to Badrinath what I noticed was:-
Following any new Sumo gold(there are a lot of them,especially in taxis) was far easier than following any Bolero,Trax cruiser and even Scorpios and Safaris.
In other words on the inclines the Sumos were moving like pros with very less noise,which means they were being driven in higher gears as compared to other SUVs.
While I noticed that Boleros,Scorpios and Safaris all three were moving like:-
Start climbing in 3rd gear,then slowly slowly their cars started loosing the power and then second gear and the car which started climbing at 50 kph ended up at 35-40 kph till the top.

Rest,no doubt..just shift one gear down and the Sumo gold is nowhere near any Scorpio or Safari,they can just smoke it and make it vanish in their RVMs in no time,but in case of Bolero..no doubt,Sumo can beat it very hard while going uphill or even coming downhill.How?Because bigger engine always offers better engine braking too..

BTW,how many of you people have heard of the TATA SPACIO?It also has a 407 engine without common rail and guys after driving this car for just 30-35 kilometers on the route to Gangotri,I can bet that this car has no match and with added tech of CRDi,I think GOLD can do lot better.

But yes,you can find a lot of new Sumo Golds in the Uttarakhand hills.And most of them are golden or white in color.

 

[dr_desai]

Okay guys,now let me put my point..

On my recent trip to Badrinath what I noticed was:-
Following any new Sumo gold(there are a lot of them,especially in taxis) was far easier than following any Bolero,Trax cruiser and even Scorpios and Safaris.
In other words on the inclines the Sumos were moving like pros with very less noise,which means they were being driven in higher gears as compared to other SUVs.
While I noticed that Boleros,Scorpios and Safaris all three were moving like:-
Start climbing in 3rd gear,then slowly slowly their cars started loosing the power and then second gear and the car which started climbing at 50 kph ended up at 35-40 kph till the top.

Rest,no doubt..just shift one gear down and the Sumo gold is nowhere near any Scorpio or Safari,they can just smoke it and make it vanish in their RVMs in no time,but in case of Bolero..no doubt,Sumo can beat it very hard while going uphill or even coming downhill.How?Because bigger engine always offers better engine braking too..

BTW,how many of you people have heard of the TATA SPACIO?It also has a 407 engine without common rail and guys after driving this car for just 30-35 kilometers on the route to Gangotri,I can bet that this car has no match and with added tech of CRDi,I think GOLD can do lot better.

But yes,you can find a lot of new Sumo Golds in the Uttarakhand hills.And most of them are golden or white in color.

The climbing ability of CR4 Gold can easily be explained.It has maximum torque of 250NM right from 1000 rpm to 2000 rpm. This means as you start car you very soon reach in the rpm range of maximum torque. The end result is that you will find other SUVs following right behind you !
CR4 is a low rpm engine.At just 2000 rpm you can reach speed of about 120km/h . I do not think at 2000 rpm you can reach even 80 km/h in Safari or scorpio.
Moreover CR4 engine has fixed geomatry turbo with Delphi system and has been designed with active involvement from Landrover team.The low engine growl is very smooth ....like a sweet melody....and certainly not annoying to years on a long drive. Diesel engine sound with wrong sound frequency invariably gives headache to the passengers particularly on a very long drive.If sound frequency is not proper even the sound sealing devices can not help much.

 

[nozzlering]

I have been following this thread since begining.
Be it public transport or personal car, Tata has proved to be a reliable and comfortable people-mover. There cant be any second thoughts about that.
Both the vehicles score more or less equal in all aspects. Except for "Comfort". Here Sumo gold scores much more than Bolero. I would definitely go for Sumo gold.

Thanks Dr Desai for your first hand report.

 

[Superbad]

My scorpio goes upto 95kmph under 2k rpm.
Just wanted to clear up things. I am sure desai was not driving the mhawk.

P.s i am yet to push mine over the 100 mark.

 

[dr_desai]

My scorpio goes upto 95kmph under 2k rpm.
Just wanted to clear up things. I am sure desai was not driving the mhawk.

P.s i am yet to push mine over the 100 mark.

If you have M2DI engine in your scorpio..... may be it is a low rpm engine and you may get that speed. There is a mathematical equation to calculate speed based on the gear ratio , final drive ratio , engine rpm and wheel size.

 

[TSIVipul]

+10 to Superbad.
Rest everything is digestable but this 80 kph point is not.
As much I remember from my Scorpio 2.6 slx and Safari 2.2 ownership is that:-
Safari used to do about 95-100-105 kph in 2k rpm in 5th gear while Scorpio used to do about 90-95 kph at same engine speed.I think this difference is also because Scorpio is having slightly higher revving engine as compared to Safari.

Rest,it can be easily felt following a Sumo Gold that it easily does the job in higher geas itself for which you need to downshift in Scorpio,Bolero and Safari.Yes,the Innova thing is slightly different or say requires quite lesser shifts which are nearly as much as the Gold requires.

BTW,have you driven Xylo mEagle?It does about 100-105 kph at 2k rpm itself.Rest no doubt this 3.0 engine is a pulling master,even Safari 3.0 Dicor was also like a locomotive even without the turbo coming to life.

 

[THE XOVER]

Yes no doubt the low end grunt generated by this deep bore 3.0 lt engine is simply mindblowing.About 10 years ago I had a privilege of sitting inside a Tata Spacio soft top variant and boy o boy did that engine had low end grunt or what?That car pulled from lower revvs like crazy.And add to that its sound was pure symphony to my ever craving ears.


Now as mentioned before Sumo Gold is a very different beast when compared to old Spacio.Tata have really refined the 3/0 lt beast this time around.Different tuning, a new vgt turbo, new suspension front and back with ARB(anti-roll bars) and better sound deadning materials which result in better insulation.

All said and done lets see how much it sells this month vis-a-vis Bolero as last month was very disappointing for the GOLD !!

 

[visran]

All said and done lets see how much it sells this month vis-a-vis Bolero as last month was very disappointing for the GOLD !!

With respect to sales, it will take some time to get traction to compete with Bolero.

 

[Superbad]

If you have M2DI engine in your scorpio..... may be it is a low rpm engine and you may get that speed. There is a mathematical equation to calculate speed based on the gear ratio , final drive ratio , engine rpm and wheel size.

i have a scorpio SLE Mhawk

 

[tornado78]

Regarding the RPM vs Speed here is my observations:

1.) My aria do the following speeds in 5th Gear
a. 1800: 80 kmph
b. 1900: 90 kmph
c. 2000: 100 kmph

 

[dr_desai]

Regarding the RPM vs Speed here is my observations:

1.) My aria do the following speeds in 5th Gear
a. 1800: 80 kmph
b. 1900: 90 kmph
c. 2000: 100 kmph

Aria and Safari shares the same engine , gearbox and final drive ratio. The speed data you have furnised are in accordance with the theoratical data.Aria has a very generous wheelbase of 2850 mm and so must be very good on highways for a long run.

 

[THE XOVER]

Just checked the sales figure of TATA UV divison.Looks like no improvement from last month.Damn! despite so many improvements still that magical 5k mark elludes GOLD.

But anyway the improvements by TATA in its UV divison which they neglected for ages is really heartening to see.If they price the new Safari well then it should increase their market share by a fair margin.