My New Honda City in White - The Albus

[Essarr]

....but can anyone help me understand why Honda is not using the same safety ratings while advertising the Indian City.
PS: I would love to be proved wrong.

When you say, "safety ratings" I think it is for Honda to respond. The safety rating for the Honda City anywhere on the globe is the same, irrespective of different testing methods. It is only when the required minimum standards of a particular country is not met that the vehicle is not permitted to be sold in that country.

But, on the other hand, if you meant to ask "Why Honda is not using the same features while advertising the Indian City?", then the answer is obvious, they are not using the same level of equipment (like alloy wheels, ICE, etc.) in India as they are in certain other countries.

Sold in manufacturing countries: Argentina, Brazil, China (Guangzhou), India, Malaysia, Pakistan, Philippines, Thailand and Turkey.
Sold in 38 other countries: Australia, Singapore, South Africa (Ballade), Poland, many Asian, African, Middle East and South American countries.

Surprised to see that the City is not found in Japan (not seen after 2008, but current model City has returned as a hybrid as Honda Grace ), USA and most European countries including the UK?

First, to understand how the end-price versus equipment (or fittings) work, you have to concede to the fact that taxes, both import and sales, India is on the high side. When imports (for parts) are reduced, so does the end prices. And Honda will hand you, the customer, the benefit of most of that. From 62% of indigenous (or Indian made) parts for the 2010-14 model, it has gone up to 76% for the current 2015 model. So, when you put inflation, GNP/GDP numbers into this bag, this year's City is actually cheaper than the previous model and with agreeably improved equipment. Body panels and shut lines may be a bother, but I am sure it will be fixed.

Examples of (approx) street prices:

2013 Honda City i-Vtec 1.5 S/MT
On the road Price India : Rs. 9,24,945 to 9,14,653 (depending on state)

For the same 2013 City S/MTmodel designation (with perhaps better/different equipment) approx:

Malaysia RM 73,626 = Rs. 12,81,573 (Rs. 3.5 lacs higher than India)

UAE (origin Thailand) AED 58,500 = Rs. 10,11,643 (Rs. 1 lac higher than India and in near import tax free country)

Australia (VTi-M) AU$ 18,490 = Rs. 8.76,404 (Rs 0.4 lac lower than India - but Honda City is not among the top 10 selling cars in Oz 2014-15). All version of City newer 2015 models are 15-20% cheaper than 2013 models.

This is not meant to prove anyone right or wrong, but make one come to a better understanding of the situation. So, if any anger has to be vented, it has to be towards SIEL Honda.

 

[pavi]

When you say, "safety ratings" I think it is for Honda to respond. The safety rating for the Honda City anywhere on the globe is the same, irrespective of different testing methods. It is only when the required minimum standards of a particular country is not met that the vehicle is not permitted to be sold in that country.

But, on the other hand, if you meant to ask "Why Honda is not using the same features while advertising the Indian City?", then the answer is obvious, they are not using the same level of equipment (like alloy wheels, ICE, etc.) in India as they are in certain other countries.

Sold in manufacturing countries: Argentina, Brazil, China (Guangzhou), India, Malaysia, Pakistan, Philippines, Thailand and Turkey.
Sold in 38 other countries: Australia, Singapore, South Africa (Ballade), Poland, many Asian, African, Middle East and South American countries.

Surprised to see that the City is not found in Japan (not seen after 2008, but current model City has returned as a hybrid as Honda Grace ), USA and most European countries including the UK?

First, to understand how the end-price versus equipment (or fittings) work, you have to concede to the fact that taxes, both import and sales, India is on the high side. When imports (for parts) are reduced, so does the end prices. And Honda will hand you, the customer, the benefit of most of that. From 62% of indigenous (or Indian made) parts for the 2010-14 model, it has gone up to 76% for the current 2015 model. So, when you put inflation, GNP/GDP numbers into this bag, this year's City is actually cheaper than the previous model and with agreeably improved equipment. Body panels and shut lines may be a bother, but I am sure it will be fixed.

Examples of (approx) street prices:

2013 Honda City i-Vtec 1.5 S/MT
On the road Price India : Rs. 9,24,945 to 9,14,653 (depending on state)

For the same 2013 City S/MTmodel designation (with perhaps better/different equipment) approx:

Malaysia RM 73,626 = Rs. 12,81,573 (Rs. 3.5 lacs higher than India)

UAE (origin Thailand) AED 58,500 = Rs. 10,11,643 (Rs. 1 lac higher than India and in near import tax free country)

Australia (VTi-M) AU$ 18,490 = Rs. 8.76,404 (Rs 0.4 lac lower than India - but Honda City is not among the top 10 selling cars in Oz 2014-15). All version of City newer 2015 models are 15-20% cheaper than 2013 models.

This is not meant to prove anyone right or wrong, but make one come to a better understanding of the situation. So, if any anger has to be vented, it has to be towards SIEL Honda.

Thanks for the reply.
I am not at all concerned about the 'feature list'. I am very young and energetic so that I could close my rear view mirrors manually, increase the seat height manually, I could easily live with out cruise control (As I live in Kerala, while on cruise control one needs to be super extra cautious and be ready to press the cancel button or apply brake once in every 2 seconds). And yes, I will be happy if I get those features in my car, but very honestly my 'economics' did not let me own a higher variant, so Honda City SV i-vtec became my destiny.

Regarding the 'safety ratings', if Honda have used the same (or approx.) in advertising the Indian Honda City, Honda could have made the buyers more inclined towards them, as Honda is becoming more and more famous for their tinny build. It could have been an assurance for the current owners, that the car is safe and they have made a right choice.

 

[Dr MUDHAN]

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PART: LXXVII :

HONDA - WE ARE PROUD OF YOU, PLEASE PRESERVE IT!
(The true & honest feelings about my Indian Honda City)

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When I switched over from Premier Padmini to Matiz, I felt Matiz was flimsy with thin metal. But consoled that the new generation design was safer, as it had better crumbling zones and an engine cross bar.

I understood, a crumple zone is designed to crumple but it should not crumple very easily so that the whole engine comes into the passenger cabin, neither it should be so rigid that it hardly crumples and transfers all the impact energy to the passenger cabin. So, striking the right balance is essential!

To make it simple, it will save the passengers at the cost of the car!

When I brought my ALBUS, THE 3RD GEN ANHC – but a face lifted version (Honestly, we were the guinea pigs to test for some of the improvements that were likely to be introduced in the 4th GEN model like stiffer suspension and an increased GC, of course proved to be positive but the pleasure was volatile as it was only a one year model, 2012 -2013)

Every time, I buy a car, there used to be a conflict between my intellectual and emotional minds.

I, as a common Indian, my priorities were always on the look, brand value, after sales service, and maintenance cost. Of course aspects of safety and resale value would be the there but last. Don’t curse me, as I have grown with a normal driving, very rarely high way driving and I never had Airbags or ABS in my past cars.

This time, I wanted to stand between both of my minds and chosen my beloved ALBUS, as owning a Honda City for a Indian middle/upper middle class is always a pride in our society , which I think so , (Read my full story)

But, after purchase my personal observations brought some disappointments, which I should honestly agree.

1. I had difficult sliding entry, what we call the Ingress/egress as I am tall and of 6 feet. ( Matiz was comfortable, though so small)
2. The outer metal sheets were thin
3. The paint coating was also thin, it was awkward when it kissed the other cars.
4. The shoes- tires were small
5. Especially the comfort of riding was not as expected, I could not feel the rubberized suspension effect like a Fiat or Ford.
6. Road noise could have been better insulated
7. Exorbitant price of the accessories/ add-on.
8. Outdated, illumination of the unmatched instrument panels and it was so silly that the Indian Honda wanted to save something by not even providing a remote control for the EMT version which came with the factory fitted HU, for a car worth almost 10 lacs.

But, the car made me to love him like a life thing, I accepted all those flaws for some reasons:

1.The car is really, beautifully crafted for that price, better & time tested engine, real pleasure to drive on a smooth road, generally better after sales service ( not like VW which will pinch your pocket), a model has its own value and definitely scope for improvements by the owner like tire upgrades.

2. The issue is same with almost all car manufactures in INDIA and it is always painful to find and compare what an Indian gets compared to their counterparts abroad.

I accepted the reality of being Indian, of course both in the strength and weakness.

The pages here will not be enough to discuss American Vs European Vs Asian and the Indian among Asian as they have their one plus and minus.

No car is perfect and there may be some near perfect cars but not affordable to most and on utility point of view as well.

FOOT NOTE:

Honda says that it is committed to providing safety for everyone—that means crash protection not only for our own drivers and passengers, but also for the occupants of other vehicles, and injury mitigation for pedestrians. Further says, the sheet metals are designed to absorb the external impact and thereby to reduce to some extend the shock of the pedestrian while collusion. G-Force control is an advanced way of designing and engineering the body so that the G-forces of a crash are dissipated as much as possible and channeled away from the occupants.

Whatever may be, it seems, what value for money for the customer may not be the value for money for the manufacturer and the competition though now try to bring some advantage to the buyer.

Honda should undoubtedly focus over the quality whatever they try to give in India and certain things like panel gap issues simply can’t be ignored.

Thanks to our forum friends (Essarr, pavi & kuwaronline ) for their heartfelt discussions over INDIAN HONDA issues.

 

[Dr MUDHAN]

Continued …

There is one more disappointment I missed to mention – I was shocked to note the place where the wheel arches meet running board - which looked crude , dated & unmatched for such a beautiful sedan.

Read Here (http://www.theautomotiveindia.com/f...new-honda-city-white-albus-41.html#post391426)

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After reading this article, one of my friend called me and shared about his experience at China.

During his recent visit he wanted to buy some electronic items. When he went to the market, after identifying him the sellers asked what kind of quality he would prefer – Indian or European?

It seems, the cheaper items they call it there as Indian quality.

He said it is not only there with our cars and in everything!

It is an unfortunate mindset and perception over Indian people.

But the world knows Indians were / are behind in every advancement of science and technology.

 

[drdoddapaneni]

Hey Dr.Mudhan,it's good to see your car in top shape after all these years.That was good,honest writing about honda.I am also a true honda fan.Despite it's drawbacks I believe Honda is the first company which introduced safety features as standard on all it's variants.I bought my Honda city EMT in 2010.At that time,that was the lowest variant.And I couldn't afford more than that and I wanted City only after taking a test drive.

The EMT version doesn't have CD player or central locking.But I wasn't bothered by that.They can be installed afterwards.The important things for me were,
1) same engine across all the variants,be it EMT version or top of the line VAT version.
2) Same airbags for all the versions.
3) ABS was standard for all the versions.
Correct me if I am wrong,but honda was the first company to offer all these safety features across all the variants.And I think that should be considered by all the companies.

Every car has it's drawbacks and City is no exception.My affection for City and Honda as a company is still the same after 5 years of my ownership.If the Civic type R comes to India I may buy another honda,until then I plan to keep my City forever.

 

[gdave]

PART X:
HONDA CITY CUSTOM A/C DASH PANEL CONTROL KNOBS / DIALS:

Somehow I felt that I should change my AC knobs which appeared to me dated and old washing machine style. I checked up some stores at Chennai and I became an alien to them. I could find the type of knob I wanted @ aliexpress.com but it was for Ford and other cars and not for my City. At last I found @ ebay.com and ordered. To my surprise it reached me within 20 days. I tried my best to remove my existing knobs, pulling out by fingers but it was very tight. Cutting plier helped me but I did it with a small press mark.
I was excited to see the new look of my dashboard panel, I tried to insert the new knob, it was not fitting in. I felt that it might be for old model City. I tried to reduce the stem length by cutting it, still it never worked. Then I felt that something was wrong with those knobs. I looked inside the original knob, I could find two clips inside which was not there. Then I felt, it was waste of money and time. I had spent around Rs.1300/- The mistake I did, I gave an excellent feedback about the seller & the product, by looking at the quality. Now what to do. I felt it very bad. Still I wanted to inform about my feeling and disappointment, I wrote to the seller about the mismatch and how it had damaged the internals when I tried to over press, hoping that it would hold.
The unexpected happened. The seller immediately responded, apologized and refunded the full money through my Pay Pal account.
The world is still good because of such nice people...!
I saw another seller @ ebay.com.ph and his display was very detailed and I could see the anatomy of the knobs. Still I wanted to confirm whether those have the two clips like original. The seller assured. The color was silver (the earlier one was black), I ordered with prayers that it should never disappoint me again. Got it within 20 days via Hong Kong mail. Beautifully matched by a click. The silver color was little bright for the black background circle so I pasted a black CFV paper neatly around the knob.
Yes, the interior became beautiful and different.

Dr. Mudhan, i got these ac knobs and tried to install them. Need help.
The first and third one went smoothly however the middle knob i pulled the existing one out but now i cant fit it. The male type thing which is inside is going back ward when i try to push. What to do?

Please help. Do i need to go to service center to get it fixed?

 

[Dr MUDHAN]

.

@ gdave​

I am afraid whether the central fan speed controller switch got loosen, could be due to your over pressure or while handling.

All the three knobs are in the same fibre mould.

If it gets inside and not firm enough to accept the new AC knob, better take the car to a good electrician who knows to remove the central console and refit it.

Be extra careful while choosing the car electrician as he should know the procedure and not to mishandle. In this thread , you can find the procedures.





REFERENCE FOR THE FOLLOWING PICTURES:
The Honda City Connection Club (HC³) Official Website -> Replacing air conditioner knobs










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[Mr.Swamy]

Long time Dr. Nice to see Dr. status is upgraded to Honoured member.

 

[Dr MUDHAN]

Long time Dr. Nice to see Dr. status is upgraded to Honoured member.

It gives me a pleasant surprise to see my thread highlighted in front page theme of our TAI forum and the comments describing it.
I am thankful to our Moderators for the way they have the reflected their appreciation over my efforts.
I was actually wondering sometime earlier that when the forum would recognize me a professional as I continue to be quoted only as an amateur in spite of my extra ordinary threads and hundreds of postings.
This recognition makes my work ever so much more enjoyable and challenging.
Thanks to everyone who are behind my efforts.
With warm regards,
Dr MUDHAN

My dear Dr,

Everytime I wanted to visit Disneyland, I would visit a few auto blogs till I discovered there was Hogwarts and ever since at least once a week I would peek in to savour and enjoy your blog.

The small little things that make this blog so unique yet grounded Eg The sticker on the mag wheel- I feel that's magic.
What causes me to actually write in again is the fact that it never struck me to even look at what your profile states. 'amateur' is ridiculous and I ask many others who visit Hogwarts to request the moderators to allow our 'Dumbledore' be promoted to 'Professional'

Dr Mudhan - Professional

Thank you so much. Yes, your wishes became true.

Regards
Dr MUDHAN

 

[Dr MUDHAN]

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PART: LXXVIII :

MY ALBUS: TWEETERS, MAKE A WORLD OF DIFFERENCE!​

“Exposure to high-resolution music with inaudible high-frequency components increases high-alpha and low-beta EEG powers and a feeling of relaxation “ ( Ref: Ryuma Kuribayashi and Hiroshi Nittono, Hiroshima University)

​

​

You need not be an audiophile; any one will like the sounds of a rain drop. The sound alone eases away stress and makes everything outside look more calm and quiet.

My ALBUS EMT version came with factory fitted front speakers which I liked but no rear speakers. I bought a pair of OE Tweeters (@Rs.6500/- which is definitely exorbitant but for the original look) and continued with OE Head Unit which I later replaced with a Chinese DVD/GPS 8’ Display. (Read Here - http://www.theautomotiveindia.com/f...new-honda-city-white-albus-48.html#post402745)

I was not happy with my aftermarket Pioneer Rear Speakers (TS-A 634) as it was a coaxial one.

I always enjoy the precision instrumental sounds and definitely felt the need for the fine rear side tweeters.

The coaxial was replaced with component one.

The value for money feeling drove me to pick up PIONEER speakers - TS-A 1605C.

The next issue was the PLACEMENT OF SPEAKERS in the rear side.

If it is a single pair, I would have chosen above the ears at the B pillars for centralized location. As I have already placed the front tweeters, being OE at the A pillars, I preferred the rear ones at the C pillars. I think in the 4th generation ANHC the rear tweeters are within the rear door pads.

I just hidden the active crossover kit- below the B pillars and took the wire from top to C pillars. I meant the controller boxes of the components which I kept behind the plastic covering in the B-pillar (just above the seat belt winders).

We decided to fix the tweeter speakers on the C-pillar, just above the rear headrests on either side, at an angle so that Tweeter A was angled towards rear passenger A, and Tweeter B was angled towards rear passenger B.

My car electrician wanted to drill a hole in the plastic cladding of C pillars to insert the tweeters but I refused, to avoid permanent damages to the original structures. Tweeters were fixed by double sided tape, but protruding out.

Though I did not like the way they were placed inside my ALBUS but I managed with a displeasure but it often fell down due its weight from the C pillars.

Finally I found a nice location and placed those tweeters, got through the wires via seat belt slit, see the picture, though hidden the high frequencies are not direct to ears!

Once that was done, we tested the speakers. Wow, what wonderful sound flowed out!

The sound was completely blissful & those babies started singing brilliantly!


TIPS:

1. Stereo sounds are scientifically designed to suit the audibility of our ears as both the ears audibility are not the same. You can feel the difference of volume and frequencies in left and right ears, to understand it, you please remove the ear phone one side & alternatively and you can feel that.

2. Over a period of time carbonized deposits in the wiring will affect the quality of sound output. If there is a change in output quality noticed later, the terminals to be cleaned.

3. We spent a lot for HU and speakers but forget the most important component of an audio system – the quality of wire that carries the sound. Speaker wire, like any other linear electrical component, has three properties which determine its performance: resistance, capacitance, and inductance. Theoretically perfect wire has no resistance, capacitance, or inductance. The wire's resistance has the greatest effect on its performance.
Don’t depend on your car electrician and avoid thinner aluminum or cheaper copper coated wires. Go for good copper wires on both the terminal and a wire of not less than 12 or 14 gauge.

Read More Here: ACTIVE – vs- PASSIVE (DIRECT) connections

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[CRACING]

Hello friends,

Small updates about my car exterior. The old school antenna is now replaced to shark fin antenna.

Bought from Aliexpress a month ago and received it today. Product link is here




The antenna color is Gray but its little whitish then my car color (Polished metal metallic), not much difference though. Actual problem is the base of antenna which is flat and car roof (around the original antenna) is curve. I didn't expected this because Dr. had also bought similar antenna which fitted perfectly to his Albus. Of course, sellers are different but antenna design is same as well as its made for VW polo Bora. Is it because 2009-11 model City has slightly curve roof and 2012-13 model City is flat, atleast around the antenna. I have doubt about this. Is it true?

The antenna bought by Quraish786 last year also had such mismatch but it was different design. Fortunately he got replacement antenna that is made for Honda City.

Now the only way was to put two layers of double sided tape to the front half and back half of the antenna, leaving middle half with no double sided tape. I used my own original 3m double side tape instead the one came with and was able to fit perfectly but due to two layers of 3m tape, its more visible, especially in the front. To cover that, I'm thinking to use gray color trim strip or vinyl around the edge of antenna and car roof.



I haven't took a photo after fitting the antenna because it was evening time but will take one tomorrow and update here.

Thanks...
Best Regards

 

[Akash1886]

Hello friends,

Small updates about my car exterior. The old school antenna is now replaced to shark fin antenna. Actual problem is the base of antenna which is flat and car roof (around the original antenna) is curve. I didn't expected this because Dr. had also bought similar antenna which fitted perfectly to his Albus. Of course, sellers are different but antenna design is same

Buddy finding a perfect accessory for a discontinued car is difficult than a existing model of same car. The molds and curvature of the antenna that you have purchased must have been the pre-facelift one and the piece sold to you could be from left overs of the pre-facelift Honda City ones i.e the one which Sir Mudhan owns. When ordering online, many times certain parameters of design of the car as well as the accessory are missed/not quoted which leads to such a mismatch.

Is it because 2009-11 model City has slightly curve roof and 2012-13 model City is flat, atleast around the antenna. I have doubt about this. Is it true?

Could be a minute difference. For reference adding my car's pic with OEM antenna.

​

Now the only way was to put two layers of double sided tape to the front half and back half of the antenna, leaving middle half with no double sided tape. I used my own original 3m double side tape instead the one came with and was able to fit perfectly but due to two layers of 3m tape, its more visible, especially in the front. To cover that, I'm thinking to use gray color trim strip or vinyl around the edge of antenna and car roof.

Don't do this because it will peel off in no time and the gap would look pronounced as ever. Best solution as I think would be to revert to OEM antenna if you have it with you. Also with this change, did you feel any change in FM reception of your car?

Regards

Akash

 

[CRACING]

Buddy finding a perfect accessory for a discontinued car is difficult than a existing model of same car. The molds and curvature of the antenna that you have purchased must have been the pre-facelift one and the piece sold to you could be from left overs of the pre-facelift Honda City ones i.e the one which Sir Mudhan owns. When ordering online, many times certain parameters of design of the car as well as the accessory are missed/not quoted which leads to such a mismatch.

Sorry, I didn't understand what you mentioned in middle part but the antenna I and Dr. bought isn't even made or mentioned to fit for Honda City.

The one specifically made for Honda City costs 3 times of VW polo antenna but its not worth to afford. So Dr. did a trial buying antenna that is made for VW polo and it perfectly matched. Other sellers who show same product in there listing are actually different so Dr. suggest to buy from the same seller he bought from. I gone for cheaper listing and endup mismatching.

Could be a minute difference. For reference adding my car's pic with OEM antenna.

I just doubted that but it couldn't be.

Don't do this because it will peel off in no time and the gap would look pronounced as ever. Best solution as I think would be to revert to OEM antenna if you have it with you. Also with this change, did you feel any change in FM reception of your car?

You're right, Vinyl is not durable. I will think about something else tomorrow but I don't like to revert back to original antenna.

There will be no difference in radio reception and its just for looks.

 

[Akash1886]

Sorry, I didn't understand what you mentioned in middle part

In simple words, design of accessories do change with the change in design of the car. (Reminded me of a Dialogue between Aamir Khan and the professor in 3 idiots, it was about definition of a book)!

Dr. did a trial buying antenna that is made for VW polo and it perfectly matched. Other sellers who show same product in there listing are actually different so Dr. suggest to buy from the same seller he bought from. I gone for cheaper listing and endup mismatching.

Veteran's words of wisdom are important. Always follow them buddy.

Regards

Akash

 

[Dr MUDHAN]

Dear CRACING

First - Sorry , I understand your feeling. I honestly feel, those who have procured from other sellers made disappointed. This is the same case with quraish786.

Please recall our discussions over this issue at page 50.

The one I purchased is little different one both externally and internally.

Newest design special car With blank radio shark fin antenna signal shark fin with 3M adhesive for VW polo Bora-in Exterior Accessories from Automobiles & Motorcycles on Aliexpress.com | Alibaba Group

(MORE PICTURES HERE:http://www.theautomotiveindia.com/f...new-honda-city-white-albus-51.html#post409497)



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I feel the shell must be the same for all 3rd GEN ANHC including Face lifted one. Creating a new shell ( little different roof curvature !) for a model which Honda knows to be short lived would not be a viable option.