Mineral Oil for DDiS - Yes or No???

[gokul4h]

Hi

I have never found an answer for this. I have an ertiga vdi 2012 model.. I need the 30,000 kms service to be done in another 2 mnths (current reading 25k km).

at 10k & 20k kms i changed synthetic oils which costed me 3300 each time.

I would like to know if there are no specific benefits or recommendations from manufacturer I would like to switch to mineral.

I had my swift'09 prior to this which had run 1 lakh kms with mineral without any issue. So im not fan of synthetic either.

Can anyone please enlighten naive people like me who are being robbed by the service centers..

Replies are appreciated. Thanks for spending time on this thread.

Regards,
Gokul

 

[Gurrala74]

Re: Mineral Oil for DDiS...Yes or No???

Go with mineral oil eyes closed and without any second thought

 

[rahulgupta3101]

Re: Mineral Oil for DDiS...Yes or No???

Go with mineral oil eyes closed and without any second thought

Gurrala sir,

Yes,mineral oils have always been there and doing the duty rather well.

Maruti for ex. used to put mineral oil in all it's vehicles prior to adopting to Fiat diesel engines.Even then during the initial days of Swift, Maruti used to fill mineral oil only.Later,Fiat issued a circular to Maruti stating the strict use of Synthetic oil (that too Mobil 1 grade 0W40) in all the diesel engines supplied by Fiat.From then onwards, Maruti service centers started putting in Mobil 1 0W40 oil.However,in petrol powered cars, they still fill in mineral.

Now, coming to pros and cons of synthetic oil :

cons :- I stated cons first, as there is only one.They are expensive and about three-four times than the comparable mineral counter part.

pros :-

1.) Better lubrication.The question is do we need it? May be not, as the RPM's our engines rotate might not do justice to the additional lubrication provided by synth. oil.Hence, it is like keeping an additional measure of safety.

2.) Engine Life :- One may argue that we have been using mineral from ages and the engines have lasted for more than a lakh km's easily.Fine, but synth. keeps your engine smooth and like new for much longer duration.

3.) Service interval :- Mineral oils need replacement every 5000 kms whereas it is 10-15000 kms (they can be used even longer, say for 20-25000 kms) in case you use synthetics.

There are more points.These are the ones I could think of right now.It basically comes down to the fact that what vehicle you are driving, how much you drive and for how long you want to keep it.

All high-end cars like Mercs/Audis/VW's/BMW's and more comes factory filled with Mobil 1 full synthetic.Even cars much smaller like Swift diesel comes factory filled with Mobil 1.We have a Swift Zdi and hence I am sure of that.

gokul4h@ Friend, you are not getting robbed. Maruti has been instructed to fill synthetic only in diesel engines as they are Fiat engines and they know their product best (Fiat recommends Shell Helix ultra fully synthetic).As you have a diesel one,service center guys filled it with synthetic.

 

[biker]

I have used mineral oil for the 2nd service. will change in 5000kms.
regarding synthetic oil, my experience is it also looses smoothness after 7000kms(had a multijet/quadrajet earlier).
Maruti Swift/Ritz owners manual shows 05W40(Semi-synthetic) as preferred while 15W40(Mineral oil) also is shown.

with MASS(Popular,Muvattupuzha/Cochin), they prefer to use mineral oil for Ritz DDIS while Swift,Ertiga they are using 05W40 oil as per circular from Maruti. as per Manager of MASS, it is due to difference in Turbo's used. Ertiga got a VGT. as per him, the turbo of new swift differs from new Ritz.
5000kms oil change for mineral oils.

 

[Gurrala74]

1. Mineral oil is good enough for all normal conditions
2. Synthetic oil will last long a bit at the same time it is expensive than mineral oil, so it is compensated there.
3. Manufacturers recommend different oils time to time based on
a) The tie ups they have this the oil companies(this is a big deal)
b) as per the engine characteristics

It is always good to follow whatever is written in the manual of manufacturers for each vehicle, hence do not generalise between swift, vista, ritz, ertiga, punto though all come with the same engines.

Yes, Synthetic oils may be good in hot summers and hot places where engine heats of quickly where our calculation of 5000km may go bit wrong while using mineral oils. this is the reason every year starting of summer, I will check the engine oil condition and preferably fill with the fresh one though I loose little more money ahead of the schedule

 

[biker]

In case of Ertiga it is different because it is using multijet with a Variable geometry Turbo and different state of Tuning for a 90bhp output unlike conventional multijet 74bhp.

 

[gokul4h]

Thanks for the replies.

I own a 2012 ertiga vdi as per manual it says 5w40 which is a semi-synthetic oil. Also manual recommends an oil change for every 10k kms. If its fiat who have forced maruti to use synthetic thenwhy the interval is not changed? (Did maruti wanted to use this for there advantage?)

Do a slightly bigger turbo require synthetic? I was using a petes box on my 09 swift which more or less created same power as my stock ertiga. Though I was changing my engine oil evry 5k.

Im somehow not very convinced with the current recommendations.

I also checked with my MASS sa he was saying that had a circular that engine change is upto the customer whether he/she wahts to go for mineral/synth.

Im very much aware that synthetic will not increase the engine life only it help the engine in those extreme conditions. (My 2 cents).

Gokul

 

[rahulgupta3101]

In case of Ertiga it is different because it is using multijet with a Variable geometry Turbo and different state of Tuning for a 90bhp output unlike conventional multijet 74bhp.

If what you said is true, then why mineral oil for Ritz and synthetic for Swift while both has same engine and similar output.

Thanks for the replies.

I own a 2012 ertiga vdi as per manual it says 5w40 which is a semi-synthetic oil. Also manual recommends an oil change for every 10k kms. If its fiat who have forced maruti to use synthetic thenwhy the interval is not changed? (Did maruti wanted to use this for there advantage?)

Do a slightly bigger turbo require synthetic? I was using a petes box on my 09 swift which more or less created same power as my stock ertiga. Though I was changing my engine oil evry 5k.

Im somehow not very convinced with the current recommendations.

I also checked with my MASS sa he was saying that had a circular that engine change is upto the customer whether he/she wahts to go for mineral/synth.

Im very much aware that synthetic will not increase the engine life only it help the engine in those extreme conditions. (My 2 cents).

Gokul

Hi Gokul,

The interval is now changed.Earlier it used to be 5000 kms, and now it is 10000 kms. However, Fiat recommends 15000 kms for it's own cars as full synthetic oils go that far easily.

Maruti cannot use it for their advantage as it is always your wish, whether you want to change the oil or not. On a regular service, you instruct them not to change oil and they will not change it. It is your car and your decision when to change it. They can only recommend not enforce.

It certainly helps increase engine life. There are numerous threads available on internet confirming this.We may not drive our regular cars so long as to realize the longevity factor.As you said, it also helps the engine in extreme conditions.

Again, it all comes down to one's own preferences which oil to put in one's ride.As Guralla sir mentioned, we should never put an oil below the recommended grade by the manufacturer.

 

[biker]

If what you said is true, then why mineral oil for Ritz and synthetic for Swift while both has same engine and similar output.

as per MASS here, Swift Turbo is different than that of Ritz hence got the recommendation for semi-synthetic. however, I am skeptical about this claim. the Owners manual of both new-swift and new-ritz shares similar pages with regards to oil recommendation(05W40 preferred and also 15W40).

 

[nozzlering]

Nice thread. I would like to clear one misconception we have.
Myth: Synthetic oil provide extra lubrication.
Fact: Synthetic oils stay stable at wider range of temperature changes. No extra lubrication.
Always follow the manual. Stick to the instructions and you will be a happy man.
I second guralla's views. Its all money, marketing.. Lets take the example of LED and LCD tvs. Both are exactly the same thing, except the lighting source. Power consumption of LCD tvs is marginally high. Just by looking at the screen majority of us cant differentiate. But you see the difference in price. Still masses go for LED. Sorry for going OT. All I want to say is mineral oil is good.

 

[tai_newbie]

Synthetic oils withstand very high temperatures when compared to the mineral oils. The molecular structure of synthetic oils is resistant to at high temp and doesnt break down like the mineral oils.

 

[rahulgupta3101]

as per MASS here, Swift Turbo is different than that of Ritz hence got the recommendation for semi-synthetic. however, I am skeptical about this claim. the Owners manual of both new-swift and new-ritz shares similar pages with regards to oil recommendation(05W40 preferred and also 15W40).

I too agree with you and it might be that MASS at your place is just cookig up this different turbocharger story.

Synthetic oils withstand very high temperatures when compared to the mineral oils. The molecular structure of synthetic oils is resistant to at high temp and doesnt break down like the mineral oils.

Exactly. The synthetic oils are basically engineered to retain their prescribed viscosity levels at extreme ends of temperature.This transaltes into the fact that the engine will have a better quality oil (viscosity wise) in extreme cold/hot climates.

 

[pankajdude]

I want to know which oil makes DDiS Smooth Synthetic or Mineral?

 

[VISHNUCARCRAZY]

Synthetic no doubt in that.

 

[Aanuj]

If you want synthetic oil for your DDiS go with Mobil Delvac 1 and not just Mobil 1. Mobil 1 is more for Petrol Cars and dont have the API CJ-4/CI-4 PLUS/CI-4/CH-4/SM/SL,ACEA E7, E9 specifications that all modern diesels require.